Helping Ourselves: Sustainable Art practices w/ Jiggle & Juice

Episode Transcript:

[00:00:00] Shae: The kind of like vision for jiggle & juice was that we would be eventually, almost like a one-stop hub for any question that you might have about. Being an artist, for example. So that's why we kind of started the support documents was so that if you didn't know how to price your work, oh, go on to jiggle and Jesus' website, you'll find the document.

[00:00:19] Shae: You can print out, you can stick up in your studio. all of those resources are there for free.

[00:00:25] Isotta: This is Art Is… a podcast for artists where we brainstorm the future of the art world and the creative industries today. I'm sharing the first half of my conversation with the artist's collective jiggle and juice formed by shame Isles and Georgia took two emerging artists who happen to be best friends and also happened to live 4,405 miles apart, jiggle and juice sometimes referred to in this episode as J and J is a fascinating example of a digital first creative collective and platform that champions, creativity, collaboration,

[00:01:04] Isotta: And fosters an open dialogue with other emerging artists on how to build a sustainable and professional art practice. Today, we'll dive into jiggle and juices, founding story mission, and there are many ongoing projects we reflect on our art school experiences and discuss the increasing impact of the digital world on emerging artists focusing, especially on the confusing and contradictory role, Instagram plays in determining our self-worth and value as artists and people. I really loved speaking with Georgia and Shay, so I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did.

[00:01:39] I am Shay miles. I'm currently based in Glasgow and, I, I'm also an artist. I graduated from Gray school of art in 2020. and I'm currently working on. mainly jiggle and GS things, but also a little bit of drawing and hopefully in the future, those drawings will turn into sculptures that I'm working on too.

[00:02:03] Shae: So I'm really excited to be waking work again.

[00:02:07] Georgia: my name is Georgia tuck. I live in Victoria, BC, Canada, all the way on the west coast. and, I just graduated from the university of Victoria in 2020.

[00:02:17] but in 2019, I went over to Scotland and did an exchange semester at the gray school of art. So that's how Shay and I. Met each other. We just instantly fell in love and became best friends. we always knew that we were going to start a project together one day in the future. And then it happened to,take the form of jiggle and juice once the pandemic happened.

[00:02:37] and so that just started in April of 2020 was our first. Project. We started with a, virtual video exhibition. And then, it kind of just snowballed into so many other things. Shay has been like the best person to work with because, every time I come with an idea to her, I'm like, maybe one day it'd be so cool.

[00:02:59] Georgia: If we could like do this thing. And she's like, okay, right now, now is the time that we're going to. That thing. And so that's why we had done so many different, projects, whether that's like through video series or, we started a book club. we're working mostly on support documents,I guess our ethos is, to bridge the gap between art school and, professional practice. And so that's what we've been focusing on mainly right now. that virtual video exhibition was just something that we want to do. Just like,in response to the pandemic and us being inspired by all the other, like virtual shows that were going on and We kind of wanted to start a platform that was just for that show.

[00:03:37] and we didn't have any plans for anything else. Really, at that point, I think we just were like, we're bored. Let's do something together. We literally just facilitated that show and it was really fun. And when we realized how much we enjoyed it and how much, people actually were enjoying what we were doing.

[00:03:55] Shae: We just went from there and, yeah, it's been so much.

[00:03:58] Georgia: what we're working on right now, is a video series called in conversation with, where we bring on like a different, creative guest and we chat with them. and then that goes onto our website. We have it as a video, as a podcast.

[00:04:12] so audio and then also, Shay has been so wonderful at transcribing all of the episodes as well, which I know takes her hours and hours to do. but one of our main things is we really preach accessibility. And so we want what we have to offer in as many different, Mediums if you want to watch, listen or read, you can do any of those things. and then we also have our book club and we are always looking for new members. so if you want to join our next book club, you are more than welcome to. we also have, like our support documents, which had mentioned before, which I think is a kind of what.

[00:04:43] Georgia: working on the most right now. so some of those include how to write an artist statement and artist's bio how to document your work, how to write an invoice, how to write a creative contract and many more with many more to come as well. what we're working on right now, which we're really excited about is our jiggle and juice artists spotlight.

[00:05:05] Georgia: So we have,a spotlight on our Instagram. So we'll share people's work on our Instagram. And then we're also working on creating an artist, database on our website. that's going to come early 20, 22. but what we want that to like is eventually you can come onto our website and you're looking for like artists research, looking to be inspired.

[00:05:26] see what else is out there? What other early career artists are doing, and you will be able to search. On our website by medium or geographical location or, themes, anything like that. And you can go and have this big database of artists. So that's kind of our next big project that we have in the works.

[00:05:46] that was inspired by, one of the support docs that we made Earlier this year, people were responding to our, Instagram question where we were like, what, support material would you like next? And people were like, oh, we really want you to talk about,how to find new RS, because on our platform, we really preach about maybe steering away from like I don't know,

[00:06:06] Georgia: Jeff Koons Andy Warhol, you know, Damien Hirst, the pale male, stale

[00:06:12] Shae: the

[00:06:12] Shae: PMs.

[00:06:13] Shae: likeI think people are looking for something new, like people that are practicing currently and building their practice. maybe don't always look at the artists that you're two tutors, like bang on about. we preach that and kind of quite aggressively, because I very much believe that. that's not beneficial. we made a little support doc that covered, like how to expand your artist's research.

[00:06:37] Shae: The database was inspired by that essentially. So, we want it to kind of like have all of the information for finding brand new artists, and like building a community through that and connecting our community through the database.

[00:06:50] it's gonna be really exciting and it's hopefully gonna inspire people to, Branch out there, RSV search and have open conversations with people who are researching similar things or, who wants to support each other in just being a fun girl or fun person.

[00:07:06] Isotta: I'm really interested in excited about the fact that although you guys did. A few years ago, you've maintained this really awesome friendship and now professional working relationship just digitally.

[00:07:18] Isotta: Could you bring us into how you facilitate that and how you maintain such strong ties? just digitally.

[00:07:24] The fact that we have been friends online for longer than we actually see. together in real life, we've had the collective for longer than we actually spent in real life. we always joke that the reason why Jaylin juices what it is, is because that's our excuse that we have to talk to each other. 'cause I feel like sometimes we're like, oh, it's life is busy. we'll just push back calls, to catch up. But if we're like, no, we have a project and we have a deadline.

[00:07:51] Georgia: We have to talk right now. And then we can also catch up after I'm meeting. I feel like jiggling juice is an incentive to maintain this relationship is having to have a project to work on.

[00:08:01] Shae: I feel like there's so many people that I would be so much closer to. If I also had a collective with them. Georgia briefly touched upon the ethos of jiggle and Jews. Could you bring us into your world and kind of why you really focused on that mission and how, and if that has evolved over the past year, since you formed JNJ.

[00:08:25] Georgia: graduating into the pandemic, everything was just really amplified. I'm sure we would've come across the same issues if there weren't a pandemic, but we just felt that. Completely ill-equipped to begin a professional practice. there was really no emphasis on the business side of being an artist during school.

[00:08:45] Georgia: We maybe had one lecture on how to write a funding application, but it wasn't really in depth at all. there was really nothing about building a website, building a portfolio, how to write a creative contract, how to write an invoice. there was just so many practical things that we felt like we just didn't have access to and just didn't know.

[00:09:03] Georgia: And so one of our like mission statements is we want to be. That place for people to go to, to find out all these answers as well as we just love, oh my gosh, we love talking about art so much. That's why we just, we can never shut up about art. And so, leaving that studio community was really hard for us to kind of just feel like we're. Thinking and talking into the void. and so we wanted to have these discussions around art, and the art world as well. And, putting that online and seeing the other people also are interested in that. and so that's why we wanted to do that as well.

[00:09:35] Shae: I feel like our mission for kind of something that we wish we had had when we were at that kind of like early stages of graduation on also while we were still out at school, because we can hate on the education system as much as we want.

[00:09:49] Shae: a four year art degree. it's not a lot of time, So I can completely understand why degrees are structured, the way that they are in that you have a lot of focus on making on your practice and like being really selfish and like maybe exploring this, but then also maybe exploring that and then hating it and then exploring that,For years is not enough to do that. Let alone dive into all of the ins and outs of, okay, how do I make this my job? how do I make money from this? And how can I actually sustain a career in this field? So I completely understand that it's really hard. it's really Turkey.

[00:10:23] Shae: So I think that if you're looking to do that, an external source. for example, us is something that I would have really benefited from. and like, knowing that, I could have someone to ask these questions to like, obviously again, we only graduated last year, so we only know so much.

[00:10:39] Shae: And we're learning at the same time as everyone else, but, having this kind of universe in this community that we can facilitate to help people in like even the tiniest way. so the, the kind of like vision for jiggling juice was that we would be eventually, almost like a one-stop hub for any question that you might have about. Being an artist, for example. So that's why we kind of started the support documents was so that if you didn't know how to price your work, oh, go on to jiggle and Jesus' website, you'll find the document.

[00:11:09] Shae: You can print out, you can stick up in your studio. all of those resources are there for free. we make them as easy as possible to print out. if you want to know like a certain thing. Within the support doc, we format it. So you can print out like that one singular page. If you want stick it in your sketchbook, like handout people like talk about it.

[00:11:29] Shae: That is like the way that we want it to be, that we would be there for you essentially, that that's like the main thing. So we want to elevate and showcase the art of other people in the same boat as us. and just kind of like show our support for. For our students.

[00:11:48] you know, coming out of art school, I at least had this really like polished mentality about everything that I needed to be really ready to share something with the world, because you know, mostly of like fear of judgment and just looking at how the art industry really presents itself also digitally.

[00:12:04] Isotta: Everything is. Perfect well photographed.that really plays on the idea of Instagram also becoming like a really hyper professionalized place. And I was wondering, especially with you, creating and providing these resources, how do you feel we, as emerging artists the new generation of, our professionals.

[00:12:23] Isotta: How should we feel about presenting ourselves online, offline, do you have any thoughts on just that whole process?

[00:12:32] my Instagram account is both my personal and my art. Like I have one Instagram, where I like will share. Photos of me on my out share,just stupid things that aren't related to my practice, but are my life.

[00:12:47] Shae: And my life is my practice. So I've never really believed in keeping that separate. I understand why people do that. but I think for my practice, especially my personal practice,I post things without thinking quite a lot of the time.

[00:13:00] Shae: And,that's like shows quite a, like a nice insight into my work and like things that maybe aren't finished, like over the course of the pandemic, I was working on like a mini video series that was intentionally, it was scary because the things I was like I was recording were like pretty intimate and pretty suggestive.

[00:13:21] I like playing with that and I think that's quite interesting. because like at the same time as people I went to school with and like my brother's friends can see that so can, the people who are like going to appreciate. The video work as a piece of video art.

[00:13:35] in my case, I don't really worry too much about what I'm put presenting, whether it's finished or not finished. and I just really the fact that my audience is quite varied. I feel like Instagram used to be fun, like way back in the day. It used to be like fun to post things. And now I feel like kind of where I've taken my Instagram is I want to post things that.

[00:13:57] Georgia: Wouldn't be on my website. Wouldn't be a finished or polished work,kind of like, experiments or, Just like out like a one-off smaller piece. that's what's making it a little bit more fun for me now is like making it its own space where the things that exist on Instagram are just for Instagram.

[00:14:15] Georgia: But then of course, as we, the three of us have even talked about Instagram is, so it's all about like quantity of comments and likes and finding validation through that. And I find. That can just be so frustrating, like putting something that you have worked on that you're proud of on Instagram and then not getting the attention that you want is it's really discouraging.

[00:14:36] the most heart wrenching thing ever is I've been working on like a drawing series a couple of months ago and I posted myfirst post of it and I like been working on. Age it's it really was something that I was like working hard at. I would sayflopped, like it didn't get nearly as much engagement as for example, a stupid selfie.

[00:14:58] something that I literally took in like 0.3 of a second why does a photo of my face get more engagement than like something that I spent so long on and So that, that's something that really is a flaw in, I don't know whether it's the algorithm or I don't really know what that's about, but that really is upsetting and the same way with jiggling juice as well.

[00:15:18] Shae: Like we sometimes post something and be like, oh my gosh, we've worked so hard on this. say a support document. that we create, Which are available on our website. And that usually get a lot of, kind of engagement people sharing onto their stories. And then that way we actually reach a lot more people. it will be really excited to release that. And then sometimes it'll be like nothing.

[00:15:37] Shae: it just doesn't perform as well as we hope. I feel like it's the same for everybody in that. you can put your heart into everything, but then a selfie will get more like.

[00:15:47] it's really interesting. You say that because it makes me think a lot about how maybe that's, because we're using the language of selfies to determine the value of something.we've kind of set ourselves up for failure in that sense as creatives living on these digital platforms.

[00:16:05] Shae: it's the whole conversation between creating art and creating content like that. Something that Georgia and I we're going to explore. Cause then it's like how much of your process and how much of your Surrounding elements of your practice, like, do you want to share and how much of that like is normal to share? Like if you feel you need to take a photo of that day for Instagram, is that something that you actually want to have out there?

[00:16:24] Shae: the whole idea of losing your practice and like, oh God, I need to make an Instagram post.

[00:16:28] Shae: Otherwise I'm going to lose followers. Like that kind of thing, is really that's something that we definitely like struggle.

[00:16:33] I don't know. I find Instagram has just, I think it's like truly like, a, it's like a dying platform. I think it's not doing what. It should anymore. And I think it's really time for us to move to a different platform or like showcase things and have different ideas and discussions.

[00:16:49] Isotta: the professional community of the art world is just so undefined. So like,Why don't we just define it ourselves on our terms, like in a really exciting digital open, transparent, accessible way. And it's literallythe industry standard has been sat by like crusty old white guys. why the fuck would we want to keep that up?

[00:17:08]

[00:17:11] Georgia: Well, we live on Instagram at jiggle and juice, and then we also have a website, jiggle and juice, collective.com. and you can find, everything that we were just talking about all on the website, and then,you can just stay for updates on our Instagram is.

[00:17:27] Shae: also, if you want to be our friend please DMS or email us, you can find our email address on the website and our DMS are always open for any questions or feedback. and yeah, we really want to keep the conversation open.

[00:17:43] Isotta: Thank you for listening to art is a podcast for artists. This was season three, episode two. This episode I'd like to thank the lovely shame miles and. For sharing their jiggle and juice magic with us. look out for the second half of this conversation coming later on in season three, where we dive into Georgian Shay's ideas on the changing nature of the contemporary art world, the phasing out of traditional artists, career paths, The rising role and need for online community and much more.

[00:18:13] Isotta: Please leave Art Is… a podcast for artists a rating and review in apple podcasts. It really helps others find us. you can support the work I do by subscribing wherever you listen. And by donating to the podcast, the link to do so is in the episode description. Also, I really love hearing from you. So please keep reaching out on Instagram at artists podcast or by emailing. listen@artistspodcast.com. That's it for now. Thanks so much and see you next Wednesday.